Mixing Travelcard and PAYG
This is another of the great benefits for Oyster users over paper tickets, yet some of those benefits are not explained very well on the TfL site. If you have a travelcard season stored on your Oyster and want to travel beyond the covered zones then you can use your pay-as-you-go balance to pay for the extra bit (or bits). And now the OEP* has been abolished you don’t need to worry about doing anything special, apart from touching in and out at both ends of your journey. This is very important, however, because the system still needs to know what journey you have made to charge you correctly.
How much will it cost
You only pay for travel in the zones not covered by your travelcard. Unlike paper extension tickets which can only be issued from the outer boundary of a zone, Oyster also works from the inner boundary as well. Thus if you have a zone 2-4 travelcard and pop into Central London one evening you only pay for zone 1 single fares*. With paper you would be charged from the last zone 2 station. If you want to travel from zone 5 to zone 1 with a zone 2-4 travelcard it will charge you the cheaper of two methods: either a zone 5 single and a zone 1 single; or a zone 5-1 single (as if you didn’t have a travelcard).
* Note that there is a special arrangement when you hold a travelcard covering zone 2 and you make a through NR+TfL journey covering zone 1. Rather than pay the inflated through zone 1 fare you will be charged the lower TfL zone 1 fare.
Things to watch out for
Oyster will charge you based on the whole journey you make, not just on the portion outside of your zones. So, if you have a zone 1-2 travelcard and start at Stratford (z3) using the Jubilee line to Waterloo, then National Rail to Wandsworth Town in zone 2 it will charge you for zone 3 in a mixed NR/TfL journey, even if your zone 3 travel was only on TfL. Most of the time this will only make a few pence difference, but it can be more. If your journey started in the evening peak then the first stage (Stratford – Waterloo) is charged off-peak as it finishes in zone 1. But when you then continue your journey and touch out at Wandsworth Town it changes to a peak mixed NR/TfL zone 3 journey. Armed with this knowledge there are two ways to get round it. First you can wait around at Waterloo until 40 minutes after your touch out from the Underground. This will mean that part two is a new journey fully covered by your travelcard. Alternatively you can touch onto a bus and then get off again. Bus travel is free with any travelcard, but touching on a bus will break the journey in two.
What happens if I forget to touch in or out?
Remember that at all times you can be charged a penalty fare if you are outside of the zones on your travelcard and not touched in. Having said that, this is what happens as far as your PAYG balance is concerned.
If you don’t touch in within your zones and then touch out outside of your zones you will be charged a reduced maximum fare which will not count towards any daily cap. Likewise if you touch in outside your zones and forget to touch out again at the end of your journey.
If you touch in or out within your zones but not when outside there will be no effect on your PAYG balance, but you can still be charged a penalty fare. This can even happen after you have passed the validators on your way out of the station.
* If you are really interested, you can read about the OEP on it’s old page.
This page updated 14 October 2011.
114 Responses
I have a very strange problem which started when I added a season ticket to my oyster card. I recently started to travel from Sutton Common to London Bridge each day. When I touch in or out at Sutton Common (which doesn’t have gates), I get Seek Assistance 94 (Card communications failed). This doesn’t happen anywhere else and never used to happen when I just had PAYG on the card. It even does it when I try to pick up my ticket renewals.
The help desk said I should get a replacement card. So I went into London this morning and got it changed by a very begrudging ticket clerk (at a station which will remain nameless) who bad mouthed the help desk and said it won’t be the card.
Well you can probably guess the rest. On the way back I touched in/out on the tube journey to Waterloo, then in at Waterloo NR – all with my shiny new card and with no problems. Touched out at Sutton Common – Seek Assistance 94. Arrrgggghhhhh!!! Told the help desk and they basically shrugged their shoulders. Double Arrrgggghhhhh!!!
The easy answer would be just not to bother touching in at Sutton Common like most other people, however, my train in the morning goes from Sutton Common (Z4) through Sutton (Z5) then onto London Bridge. Post OEP, I always want to touch in at Sutton Common just in case there is an RPI on the train before reaching the sanctuary of Z4 again at Hackbridge.
I am completely baffled by this. It sounds like there might be something wrong with the system at Sutton Common but who knows.
Hi Simon,
It’s a longshot, but do you have any other contactless cards like debit cards or staff entry passes? These sometimes cause problems with Oyster because the reader can’t get a clear signal. I’d expect the problems to be more widespread than just one station, but you never know. Code 94 means card communications failed which is what I’d expect in this instance. It doesn’t tally with you not having problems before loading a travelcard though.
The other issue which sometimes happens is you touch for too long and get “seek assistance” after validly touching in. I don’t think this is code 94 usually. If you can visit the Underground station at London Bridge and check journey history from one of their ticket machines it might give you a clue.
If there is no other explanation then I would tend to agree that it might be the equipment at Sutton Common, but this isn’t a problem I’ve heard before.
Regarding your desire to touch in to avoid problems in zone 5, I can see what you mean and I agree it would be wise to be touched in. You will have to chase it through with the help desk.
I’ve got various chipped credit and debit cards and a contactless passcard for work. However the oyster card is in its own blue folder entirely separate from the others. I keep it in my top pocket when travelling, well away from the other cards and because it is in its own dedicated folder there is nothing else close to the reader when I touch in or out.
The help desk said that the equipment at Sutton Common is the responsibility of FCC so I have dropped them an email but I’m not holding my breath.
Hi Simon,
There’s nothing wrong with storing the cards next to each other, it’s just that when you touch, the Oyster must be on it’s own. It sounds like this is the case anyway. Good luck with FCC.
I think I have solved the mystery – it’s my less than optimal touching in/out techinque.
It appears that the card readers at Sutton Common are somewhat more fussy as to the touching in/out technique employed than those at the other stations I frequent. Relative to what I have become used to as the norm elsewhere, a slow and deliberate placing of the card on the reader is required at Sutton Common.
I made a return journey into marylebone from gerrards cross (for which i paid for and used a chiltern line ticket). I used my payg oyster to travel around london, then used my return rail ticket to travel from marylebone back to gerrards cross. I was careful that entering/exiting gerrards cross and marylebone i did not use my oyster card.
but my oyster card was charged with a journey to and from marylebone from chalfont and latimer station (my usual route into town). I queried this with oyster, but they just replied that:
“Our records show that you have been charged correctly for your journeys on the date in question. As this is the case I have taken no further action.”
What gives?
It seems strange. Did you get off the train at Chalfont and Latimer station in each direction? I must admit that I have walked past gates and validators on many occasions while using paper tickets and I’ve never had a stray charge appear on my card. I’ve certainly never incurred a charge when passing through a station. Do you have your journey history or statement? I’ll send you an email address if you need to attach it to something.
Just a small thing. Under “How Much will it Cost?” you make the point that Oyster works from the inner boundaries of travelcards as well as the outer. I suppose that there are no inner boundaries any more with the annoying abolition of zones 2-x travelcards.
All the best
Harry
You cannot buy day travelcards or get Oyster caps which don’t include zone 1, but period travelcard seasons can be bought for any number of zones from 2 up to all 9. If you live in zone 5 and work in zone 4 then you can have just zones 4 and 5.
Hi, I’m heading down next week and was about to top up my PAYG, but having not used my card since February 2008, am I right in thinking that the card will need reactivating at one of the stations before I can use it, even if I’ve topped it up online? Thanks!
Hi DJ,
No, your card should work fine. Unless the card has been cancelled because you reported it lost or stolen it remains active. Any PAYG credit will also be fine as it never expires. However, if you topup online then you do need to nominate a station to collect the topup from. You cannot collect online topup on a bus.
Thanks – I had read something in a couple of places about having to re-activate after a 24 month period but couldn’t find any mention on the TFL site.
I have an annual zone 1-5 Oyster card, and because it is an annual card, I have a gold card giving me discounts on national rail. When travelling out of London I usually use the ticket machines and buy a paper ticket, selecting the gold card discount. For example, my ticket would cover me from London terminals to Bournemouth. However I bought a ticket at the ticket office last week, and because I’d shown my gold card (which displays zones 1-5 on it) for my discount, the ticket he gave me was ‘Boundary zone 5′ to Bournemouth. So I used my Oyster to touch in at Waterloo, and my paper ticket for Bournemouth at the other end. This means I never touched out on my Oyster card (although I have PAYG credit on there, which wasn’t charged) – would this ever be a problem? No one checked tickets on the train, but if they had, would they have had an Oyster reader, even as far out as Bournemouth? Purchasing a boundary of zone 5 ticket instead of London terminals made my ticket a lot cheaper – is there any way to select this on the National Rail ticket machines (or on the National Rail website in advance), or do these tickets always have to be purchased from the ticket office?
Apologies for all the questions – this is new to me. I knew that you could use Oyster on some NR services, but assumed that it was only for journeys made completely within the Oyster zones – if I can always buy boundary of zone 5 tickets, this could save me a fortune! Any advice on when I can use these tickets and how I can purchase them would be much appreciated
Hi Ali,
There is no penalty for incomplete journeys within the zones covered on your travelcard. Yes, SWT RPIs would probably have Oyster readers and could check that you had a zone 1-5 travelcard, but if they didn’t have the reader then that is their problem, not yours. Unfortunately you can only buy BZx tickets at a ticket office, or possibly over the phone. You can’t use websites or TVMs except that a phone ordered ticket could be picked up from a TVM. You can always use a BZx ticket with a travelcard, regardless of whether the train stops at the boundary station or not. This is because they are both zonal tickets.
Hope that helps.
Heres a quick question…
If I had a zone 3-6 travelcard on my oyster card and wanted to travel from Slade Green to London Bridge on a normal weekday using National Rail
but I tapped in at 09:25 at Slade Green station and caught a train before 09:30 would the system be intelligent enough to charge an off-peak fare between Greenwich and London Bridge as that part of the journey would definately be Off-Peak!
Or would you have to alight at Greenwich and tap back in again and catch the next train (which wouldn’t be ideal!)
Effectively, it if doesnt give you an off-peak fare in theory you could contest the fact with the Oyster helpline as Oyster is meant to charge the cheapest fare….
Chris
I agree it would be nice if it did charge you the off-peak fare, but I know it won’t. It’s an example of one of the many anomalies, mainly surrounding journeys made up of more than one part. The key thing to remember is that the overall journey decides which fare scale (TfL, NR or TfL+NR) and whether it is peak or off-peak. The system then deducts the bit of the journey covered by your travelcard and only charges you for the uncovered section(s).
Whilst your example is a lose, if you repeat the journey starting at 1555 then the passenger wins.
Bit confused by ‘things to watch out for’ paragraph. If I take overground train from Wimbledon to Waterloo and then to piccadilly (but only have a zones 1-2 annual travelcard- then will I just be charged for an ordinary zone 3 journey on the pay as you go credit? I also have my oyster linked to a young persons railcard… so it’s extra confusing!
Hi Hector,
Sorry to have confused you. In your example you will be charged for a zone 3 journey on the mixed NR&TfL scale. As it happens, this scale is identical to the NR only scale unless you are being charged for zone 1 travel, which you aren’t as you have a travelcard for zones 1 and 2. Your railcard will reduce the fare if it’s off peak.
Note that peak or off-peak is decided by touch in at the start of the overall journey. If you touch in at Picadilly Circus at 1550 and touch in at Waterloo at 1605 then the charge for zone 3 will be off-peak, even though that leg of the journey started in the peak.
Here’s another oddity. If you make a mixed TFL and NR journey partially outside and partially inside your zones, but the part outside your zones was entirely TFL, you will still be charged the mixed-mode rate for that.
For example, I have an annual Z1-3 Travelcard, and if I go on an off-peak journey from Heathrow Terminals 1-2-3 (zone 6) to London Bridge (zone 1) by tube and on to Charlton (zone 3) on Southeastern, I will be charged £1.15. But if I just go from Heathrow into central London it’ll be 95p. So making an additional journey that’s normally free costs me 20p!
[I know in this case I can break the OSI by waiting around at London Bridge or touching in on a bus, or (as I do) going to Waterloo East instead where I can just omit to touch in, but I'm sure a similar scenario can be concocted.]
Hi Thomas,
Thanks for the comment. It’s just like my Stratford to Wandsworth Town example really. The difference isn’t usually much unless there is a peak vs off-peak aspect, especially with a railcard involved. The cure for most journeys of course will be for TfL and the TOCs to agree to harmonise all pricing so it won’t matter.
Hi, Any advice appreciated – I am starting a new job which is right next to Waterloo station and will not require further links to the tube. I Live in Kingston which has Oyster card reader. can you advise what would be the chapest option for me as I will be making this return trip on a daily basis?
Cheers
Hi Vinnie,
Sorry for the delay replying. Assuming that you make your commuting journeys in the peak hours then you will probably be better off with a point-to-point season ticket from South West Trains rather than a travelcard on Oyster. If you work shifts such that many of your journeys can be made outside the peak then Oyster PAYG may be cheaper. Remember that peak fares are determined by touch in time between 0630-0930 and 1600-1900.
Hi,
Mike I must say it is extremely informative reading up on your suggestions. I am sure you will be able to help me with your advice. I have always worked and lived within south London, so have always driven around Croydon, but recently I got a job all the way in Chingford (Z5), so driving their from East Croydon (Z5) at peak hours is out of question. Now I am sure my query must have been put to you by many people before, but like I said I am a bit new to this oyster business.
My Normal commute
Monday – Wednesday —–East Croydon (Z5) – Feltham (Z6)
Thursday & Friday ————East Croydon(Z5) – Chingford (Z5)
All I would like to know that could I avoid buying a 1-5 travel card weekly which is £47.50 at the moment. And could I do with Z2-6 which seems to be cheaper ?
For Feltham I normally take national rail service from Clapham Junction. But for Chingford can I do the following on a Z2-6 weekly travel card ?
East Croydon to Clapham Junction
Clapham junction to Vauxhall
Victoria line—Vauxhall – Walthamstow central
Walthamstow central—Chingford
Hi Mamoon,
Unfortunately using the Victoria Line across Central London would incur a zone 1 charge. You cannot do the journey from East Croydon to Chingford in one go without being charged for zone 1. The best I can find is to go via Willesden Junction which avoids zone 1. You would need to touch out there and then touch back in again so that your journey becomes two separate ones. That would slow your journey down quite a bit. However, rather than go the whole hog and get a zone 1-6 travelcard, you could get the zone 2-6 version and use PAYG balance for the zone 1 bits. Using todays fares that would be 4x£1.90=£7.60 which is a lot cheaper than the £16 difference between the 2-6 and 1-6 weekly travelcards. Obviously you might need to reconsider your options if you started to go to Chingford more than Feltham.
Hope that helps
Thank you for your reply Mike, it surely is a great help. This £1.90 charge is it for the day to travel through Zone 1 or will this be taken from my PAYG balance every time I touch a barrier in Z1
The £1.90 is for every journey which involves zone 1. You said you only go to the Chingford office twice a week, so you would be spending £7.60 for zone 1 journeys.
Sorry for the dumb questions but will it be £3.80 deducted from my PAYG balance or will it be £1.90 at Victoria and the other £1.90 at Waltamstow when I finish my journey on the Victoria line.
and if it will be the 1.90 and1.90 then how would it know that I am travelling through Z1 at walthamstow as walthamstow is in Z3
This is how it should work assuming you have a zone 2-6 travelcard season stored on your Oyster card, the journey is peak and you make each interchange within the allowed times.
Touch in at East Croydon – no deduction because you are within your zones.
Touch out at Victoria NR – £2.00 deduction because you have travelled within zone 1 on NR
Touch in at Victoria LU – £2.60 deduction to bring your total deduction up to the entry charge for mixing PAYG and a Travelcard
Touch out at Walthamstow Central LU – £2.70 credit back because your journey is now a National Rail through one and only the TfL zone 1 charge of £1.90 is required because your travelcard has zone 2 included. See the bottom of this page on the TfL site for further information.
Touch in at Walthamstow Central NR – no deduction because you are back within your zones.
Touch out at Chingford – no adjustment because you are still within your zones.
I hope this helps now.
Oh that explains a lot. Mike what if I am
touching in at Vauxhall to get on the Victoria line and touching out at Walthamstow central, then how much of my PAYG balance will be used on a return journey with a Z2-6 travel on my oyster
The same amount because the overall journey (East Croydon to Chingford) is still a National Rail through journey. Because Vauxhall is dual zoned (1 and 2) you would only see the £1.90 charge taken on exit at Walthamstow Central.
Sorry Mike & Mamoon.
The OSI charging logic means that you cannot pay less at the end of a multi leg journey than you paid at the end of the previous leg – i.e. you will pay £2 on the way to Chingford and £1.90 on the way back.
The outbound will play out like this (provided the maximum journey time is not exceeded):
Touch in at East Croydon – no deduction because you are within your zones.
Touch out at Victoria NR – £2.00 deduction because you have travelled within zone 1 on NR
Touch in at Victoria LU – £2.60 deduction to bring your total deduction up to the entry charge for mixing PAYG and a Travelcard
Touch out at Walthamstow Central LU – £2.60 credit back
Touch in at Walthamstow Central NR – £2.60 deducted (assuming touch before 09:30) as the mixed travel journey from East Croydon is reopened again
Touch out at Chingford – £2.60 credit back
If Mamoon changes at Vauxhall to the Tube, he will only pay £1.90 both ways.
Thanks for that comment, Jack. However, I do know of one instance where just such a reduction took place. Also, I would wager that a significant proportion of zone 1 extension through journeys on a travelcard including zone 2 are made first on NR only in the peak. If what you are saying is correct then the TfL website has a serious error on it. However, if you have an authoritative source for your statement please do provide it so that I can take the matter up with the helpdesk.
i have a quick question, i want to go from hounslow east (zone 4) to cyprus DLR station (zone 3) approximately 4 days a week. I will pass through zone 1 as it is the fastest route. If i get a zone 3-4 travel card, is the system intelligent enough to deduct a zone 1 fare, because on the journet history only the start and stop stations are listed. i will be changing trains at green park (jubilee line) and canning town (DLR).. but i will only be touching in at zone 4 (hounslow east) and touching out at cyprus (zone 3)
The system is actually intelligent enough to charge a zone 1-2 fare from your PAYG balance in that situation. Basically it knows what is the likely route between any two stations on the system and charges accordingly. It will take account of any travelcard(s) held and deduct the remainder from the balance.
What a great website!
Anyway, my questions, following on from the above:
1. Say I’ve got a Z3-5 Travelcard and want to go from Chiswick to East Croydon. The best way is probably to change at Clapham Junction – presumably the system will charge me for a Z2 ticket? (Unless of course I go via Wimbledon but then it will know I’ve entered the tram instead which is a separate journey).
2. On a completely different note, say I have a Z2-5 Travelcard. Then say I buy a Heathrow Connect ticket from T123 to Hayes+H, but actually want to travel onwards. I can leave at Ealing no problem as I’m in-zone, but what if I want to go to Paddington? To be charged correctly I would need to have touched in somewhere – are there validators on the platform at H&H? Are they placed suitably close to every door set to be able to use them and jump back on the same train?
TIA for your help. I’m actually moving to London in a couple of weeks and am trying to get up to speed – I’ve only been a (very) irregular visitor so far!
Hi Michael,
1) Yes, it will charge for a zone 2 national rail journey.
2) Mixing paper tickets with PAYG Oyster (even if partly covered by a travelcard) is one of the limitations of the system. You will need to touch in at the end of your paper ticket. I don’t know what validators are present at Hayes and Harlington, but you may well have to get the next train.
Hope that helps.
“If you touch in or out within your zones but not when outside there will be no effect on your PAYG balance, but you can still be charged a penalty fare. This can even happen after you have passed the validators on your way out of the station.”
Can you clarify what the penalty for this would be please? If I have zone 1-2 travel card, touch in at Liverpool Street, but not out at Maryland (Zone 3) would there be an extra charge applied to my card.
The same if I don’ t touch in at Maryland but touch out at Liverpool Street?
The extra charge would not be applied to the card, no. If you are stopped by Revenue Protection Inspectors outside the zones covered by your card and without a recent touch in then you would be liable for a penalty fare. This is £20 on most National Rail services and £50 (reduced to £25 for prompt payment) on TfL operated services including Overground. If they are watching the validators and see you fail to touch out they can still issue a penalty fare even though you have left the platforms. The offence is travelling without a valid ticket or validated smartcard.
Hey Mike, great site, it’s been really useful.
I’ve got a number of questions regarding the cheapest way to travel, using a mix of Travelcards and PAYG or just travelcard.
I live in Zone 3/4 (Leytonstone) and will have to commute to Farringdon Zone 1 three times a week (9am-5pm).
Maybe once or twice a week I will be travelling on the weekend or weekdays I have off around Zones 1 2 and 3.
Now I’ve been doing a lot of spread sheeting but I’m still not quite sure what to go for, barring z2-3 Travelcard.
I am eligible for a 16-25 railcard so I might link that into my account and get 1/3 off of off peak charges, considering I take a number of train journeys a year to make it worth it.
So what do you suggest, a Z1, Z1+2 or Z1+2+3 Travelcard, a mix of Travelcard+PAYG or just straight PAYG.
I wish there was an easier way to tell what would be cheapest.
Any suggestions?
Hi Sean,
It’s not really possible to advise with the details available so far. If on days that you don’t go to Farringdon you will be using zones 2 and 3 then a zone 2-3 travelcard is probably worth it. Whether you include zone 1 depends on just how much you will go over the three days a week. It sounds like it could be swings and roundabouts. Sorry I can’t be more help.
Hi mike! I have a 16-26 railcard and travel from clapham junction to guildford daily. Is it worth my while using my oyster card from clapham junction to surbiton and then a weekly ticket to guildford? I dont like buying a season ticket as i may work from home some days. thanks
I don’t think you’d gain anything with your suggestion, unless you were travelling outside of the peak times and could get off-peak discounted fares. You would also have to change trains at Surbiton while you touched out the Oyster and came back in with the paper ticket.
Hi Mike
If I have a zone 2 travelcard with some PAYG credit and tap in and out at zone 2 stations but travel through zone 1 (without getting off) – will the machines work out that I’ve travelled through zone 1 and deduct PAYG credit accordingly or will I get away with it but run the risk of receiving a penalty charge if someone stops and checks me when the train is going through a zone 1 station?
Many thanks!!
1) The system will know you’ve travelled through zone 1.
2) As long as you have touched in and have at least enough credit for a zone 1 journey you will not get a penalty charge.
HI, just come across your brilliant site…what a wealth of information! I’m hoping you may be able to throw some light on a problem my daughter had a while ago (I’m trying to get hold of the history as you’ve suggested elsewhere and awaiting, I hope an email statement). Meanwhile… My daughter put a 7day bus travelcard on her 18+ Oyster card but when she then went on a tube it negated it. Is this normal? She says a friend has had the same thing happen. Any thoughts?
Hi Sheila,
There does seem to be an issue with some products and the 18+ student oyster. I can only suggest folowing it up with the helpdesk if the journey statement suggests that you have been overcharged. Sorry I can’t be more help.
Mike, I am travelling from Waddon (Z5) to Canary Wharf (Z2)and home each day. I have a Zone 2-5 travelcard.
A) I took a journey from Canary Wharf to Canada Water (Jubilee line Z2) and changed to Overground down to West Croydon (Z5) and then Southern on to Waddon (Z5). Therefore I have avoided Zone 1 but when I checked out it charged me £1.90 as if I had travelled through Zone 1.
This can’t be correct as if I had left the Jubilee line in Zone 1 then I would have passed through a barrier and the system would know. Am I correct? Would TfL refund this if I contact them do you think?
B) If I had taken the DLR from Canary Wharf to Greenwich and then Southeastern into London Bridge and crossed over the platforms to a Southern train to Waddon would I be charged for entering Zone 1?
Hi Captain,
A) There is a definite error here. The Single fare finder gives two fares with the cheapest one via Canada Water as you travelled. To indicate that route you should touch on the pink validator if using PAYG. I’d call the helpdesk, or email them, and ask for a refund of the £1.90. This is one of those routes that I think should have a different default when a travelcard is stored on the Oyster. It would be handy to know whether the pink validator would still correct the fare if you do it again. Also, do you need to touch in/out at Waddon? If not then I suggest you don’t as that will make the journey an incomplete one within your zones and thus no charge.
B) Peversely, it would appear not. The default route from Canary Wharf DLR appears to be to Lewisham, then Peckham Rye, then to Waddon. As long as you don’t touch anywhere else then that is what the system will assume you’ve done.
Hope that helps, and please let us know how you get on getting a refund.
Hi Simon.
I need to purchase a new season ticket as I am moving home to outside of the TfL zones. I will be using NR services to get to London, and have been quoted £3200 for the year for the train ticket including TfL Zones 1-6.
I have worked it out that it would be far cheaper to get a train ticket valid to a station within zone 6, and purchase a zone 1-6 Oyster season ticket.
Would this be valid, if I was to stay on the train and allow the Oyster card to ‘kick in’ without touching in with the Oyster Card? Or would I have to get off the train, touch in and then get the next train?
I have looked at the TfL website and according to that you can be issued a penalty fare if you do not touch in with a pay as you go season ticket, but it is fairly ambiguous.
Thanks.
Hi Gary,
First a query. Are you sure that an annual season to the first station within the zones plus an all zones season is going to be cheaper than a combined ticket? I’ve checked out Longfield which happens to have an annual season to London zones 1-6 at £3200. The annual season to St Mary Cray is £1468 while an annual zones 1-6 travelcard is £2016.
Anyway, with a zones 1-6 season ticket on your Oyster card you would not be using pay as you go. The combination of paper season and Oyster season is valid as long as the train used calls at the station where you changeover. If you want to take a fast train then you would need to make both tickets zonal. This doesn’t work from everywhere, but if you add zones 4-6 to the outside the zones ticket and put zones 1-3 on the Oyster then you can use fast trains. It is still likely to be more expensive than the single season for the whole journey.
Hope this helps.
Mike, thanks for your response. Basically it would be from Hatfield into London on a paper ticket, and then I was hoping to use an Oyster season ticket for travelling in London.
If the train was to stop in Hadley Wood (zone 6), New Barnet (zone 5) or Oakleigh Park (zone 4) am I allowed to use the paper ticket for travelling to / through one of those stations, then without having to get off and touch in, use my Oyster card to touch out at say Finsbury Park or Kings Cross, en route to my final destination within London, and on the TfL network.
In doing so, I could purchase the FCC annual ticket for £900, £1000 or £1200, then an Oyster card season ticket zones 1-6 for £2018, zones 1-5 for £1880, or 1-4 for £1576. Combined, either of these options are cheaper than the £3200, it is just a case of whether I am allowed to use the Oyster without touching in.
The TfL website only mentions being penalised if you do not touch in whilst on a pay as you go Oyster Card, and does not say whether or not the same restriction applies to a season ticket.
Yes, you are allowed to do that. There is no penalty for not touching in or out when within the zones covered by your travelcard season. The only exception is when you want to use PAYG to travel beyond the zones but within the Oyster area. In that instance you must touch in and out so that the correct fare can be deducted, and avoid the possibility of a penalty fare if checked outside your zones.
Do remember though that the reason those fares are so competitive is that you cannot use fast trains that do not call at your changeover station. If you needed to do so on the odd day then you could purchase a day ticket because when only one ticket is a season the train does not need to call at the station.
Hi Mike
I have a zone 1-4 monthly travel card but in some cases I have been unable to tap in and out at the start or end of my destination (zone 4). I just wanted to check that the information you provided above is correct, that I cannot be charged for this? There have been cases where inspectors have checked my oyster and can see that I have a zone 1-4 and have said no further and I have also checked my oyster history and no charge has been deducted.
Hi CK,
Within your zones there is no penalty for failing to touch in or out. The only exception is when your journey will take you outside your zones. In that case you must touch in and out at either end so that the system can charge you the correct extension amount.
Thanks Mike, also just wanted to check, although I go no further than Zone 4 the train itself ends in Zone 5?
Where the train goes is irrelevant; it can even end up outside the Oyster area. It is where you go while on the train that is important. Taking my line as an example, if your commute was between New Eltham and Charing Cross then as long as you stayed between those two points you would be fine. However, if you wanted to visit a friend in Crayford after work you would need to touch in at Charing Cross and out at Crayford so it could charge you for zones 5-6. Likewise at the end of your visit you would touch in at Crayford and out again at New Eltham so that the same zones could be charged again.
i m from east ham zone 3…need to go to ealing broadway in zone 3..can you tell me which zone weekly card should i buy..where i can save money…n can use the tube …
You’d need a zone 1-3 travelcard. I don’t see any easy way of saving money with that journey. To avoid zone 1 you would need to change at West Ham, Stratford and Shepherd’s Bush, but that would take considerably longer. You would possibly need to touch on the pink validator at Stratford to convince the system that you hadn’t taken a direct train.
Hi Mike, in reference to my earlier question…
I requested a complaint online twice without reply. I called the refunds line as they had always been helpful previously. Again they sorted the issue out straight away and I received my refund the following day. I have since received responses from the Online refunds team who said that because I had not used the pink validators I was not entitled to a refund. I have responded to ask them which route I could have taken through Zone 1 without having gone through a ticket barrier as I dont think there is one.
Also all the TfL literature says the pink validators are for PAYG users and I had a Travelcard. I pointed this out to them. Just have to wait three months now for a response!
In conclusion I will always call them in future!
Thanks for the update, Captain. I’d be very interested to hear their next response.
Wow mike you are really a wealth of information. Hopefully you will be able to advise me as you have countless others on thsi site.
I live in tulse hill but need to go to south ken monday to friday for work. Since I already have a 1 month travel card for z2-3 I take the bus to brixton, the victoria line to victoria and district to south ken. Knowing that I pay 1.90 for the zone 1 journey. Going home i stick to the buses cos i can get the bus 2 straight home from victoria. But in the moring its too hectic to do that.
I have 2 questions do u think i am saving mony but making my journey this way. My travel card expires next week friday and i am wondering should i just buy an annual pass for z2-3 as i live in z3 or should 1 buy z1-2 as i work in zone.
Which would work out cheaper do you think?
Hi Tony,
I would go for the zone 1-2. You only use trains in those zones and buses are free with any travelcard season. The difference between the weekly tickets is £6.80 yet you are spending £9.50 on zone 1 singles each week. The difference will be proportionally similar for longer period tickets. The only change is that the PAYG deductions are made at the time while the season is obviously paid up front. But if you buy the annual before Jan 2nd then you’ll get the old price and the zone 1 single goes up to £2 next year.
Hope that helps.
I cannot find anywhere information on what to do in the situation whereby you have a National Rail season pass, in my case Kingston to Vauxhall but have the occasional day where I meet friends centrally and so want to get the train all the way to Waterloo.
Am I expected to get off the train at Vauxhall, exit and swipe back in again using my Oyster?
I see a lot of information regarding travelcards on oysters but it is more expensive for me to get a 2-6 travelcard than a season pass between these two stations only.
Any help much appreciated I am really struggling with this!
Thanks
Hi Mike,
I am wondering whether you could help me, I am travelling on business in a group of 3 and I am not sure whether I should get a Oyster PAYG or a Travelcard+Oyster PAYG or a Travelcard on a Oyster over a 2 week period. I would be grateful if you can suggest some cost-worthy option for me.
(1) Travelling from East Croydon station (z5) to Victoria station (z1), Paddington station (z1), South Kensington (z1) [multiple trips within z1] and back to East Croydon(z5) of up to 3 times per week.
(2) I understand that East Croydon station is operated by national rail but does it have the station capability to accept the tapping of the oyster card or is it mandatory I have to use a paper travel card?
(3) I will need to use the trams as well, in this instance, a travelcard would be invalid and an oyster would be more suitable?
Would be grateful if you could help in my many enquiries, many thanks.
Calista
Hi Calista,
Sorry for the delay replying.
(1) 3 times per week is unlikely to make a weekly ticket worthwhile, you’d be better off using PAYG, especially if you can start after 9.30.
(2) You can use Oyster at East Croydon, and all NR stations within the zonal area except Stratford International and the NR stations at Heathrow.
(3) Travelcards are valid on trams as long as they include any of zones 3-6.
I hope that helps.
Hi Kyle,
Sorry for the delay replying. If you want to mix Oyster PAYG and a paper season then you do need to get off at the interchange station. At least with Vauxhall there are plenty of trains and it is a dual zoned station so you won’t be paying for a zone twice.
Hi Mike
Would be grateful if you could help me with a query, as I am a bit confused with tfl website and helpline. I will be starting a new job in Jan and would need to travel by bus, tram and tube from Wallington to High St Ken. (Will travel to Earls Court and walk to avoid zone 1) Had originally thought I would need to add a 2-5 zone season ticket to my payg oyster card, but now I am not so sure. Details of journey are:
1. Bus – Hilliers Lane to Wandle Park/Therapia Lane
2. Tram – Wandle Park/Theraia Lane to Wimbledon
3. Tube – Wimbledon to Earls Court
Believe I should now buy 2-4 zones, do you agree?
Many thanks
Hi Sharon,
Good news. That itinerary only needs a zone 2-3 travelcard. Buses are free with any travelcard and trams are free with a travelcard containing any of zones 3-6. Your tube journey is only in zones 2 and 3. You can also get a bus from Earls Court to High Street Kensington if you want.
HI been travelling to work recently from Tulse Hill to Gidea Park but going avoiding zone 1 but the oyster card is charging me as though I am going through zone 1 have spoken to tfl but they seem to think this is the default route and have been charged correctly but have gone to Stratford, then Canada Water and then to Crystal Palace and Tulse Hill so have avoided zone 1 is there any way to get tfl to refund the money they should be refunding as it is quite a lot of difference in the costs of the journey.
Hi Kevin,
I’ve got bad news, a workaround, and a glimmer of hope at the end of the tunnel. First the bad news. There is only one route from Gidea Park to Tulse Hill and that is via zone 1. Tulse Hill is far enough round from Crystal Palace for them to decide that it’s unlikely anyone would go that way. However, there is an alternative route from Gidea Park to Crystal Palace via Canada Water as long as you touch on the pink validator at Canada Water. If you then touch out and back in again at Crystal Palace it will split the journey into two with the last bit a single zone journey. This would be cheaper than the default fare to Tulse Hill. Taking next years fares, Gidea Park to Tulse Hill is £6.90 (£4.60 off-peak), Gidea Park to Crystal Palace is £3.60 (2.30) and Crystal Palace to Tulse Hill is £1.60 (£1.40).
Obviously that isn’t ideal, but it might convince you to invest in a travelcard season instead. If you do, you would need zones 2-6. If you have to touch in to open gates at Tulse Hill then you will still need to touch out and in again at Crystal Palace or the system will still think you’ve gone via zone 1 and charge the difference to your PAYG balance. You shouldn’t need to use the pink validator at Canada Water if you have a travelcard season.
Finally, there is a new line being built between Peckham Rye and Surrey Quays. When that is open I think that the default route for your overall journey may well change. At the very least they should give you an alternative in the same way that they do for Crystal Palace.
Hope that helps.
Hi Mike,
I live in Chingford and work in East Croydon.
I was wondering if I could buy the zone 2-5 monthly card which is 111.40 instead of the monthly sonze 1-5 which is 191.30. I will then supplement it by paying the £1.90 which is required because the travelcard has zone 2 included.
This will mean a daily cost of 3.80 (return). I only go into work 3 times a week so I reckon in a month I will have incured total daily charges 3.80 * 3 days * 4 weeks = 45 * 112 (zone 2-5 card) making a total cost of 157 a month which is much cheaper than the 191 Zone 1-5 Card.
Can this be done?
I can see you explained this to Mamood above but that was with a zone 2-6 card but I am assuming that a zone 2-5 should suffice for this as I dont have any zone 6 area in my travel.
Your advice will be much appreciated.
Tony
Hi Tony,
Yes, it will work for you as well. You have slipped up in one respect as the zone 1 single is now £2.00, but it doesn’t invalidate the saving.
Thank you Mike, Much appreciated
Hello. Great website. When my gold card (z1 – 8 +W) expires in February I would like to explore cheaper options. I live in watford and work at Vauxhall. I was thinking of getting a Z1-2 gold annual at £1168 and then doing PAYG all on oyster. I generally leave work at 6.30pm so I flirt with the 1900 end of peak. If using the above combination of a Z1-2 travelcard and PAYG from Z3 – W, I touched in at Euston before 1900, but touched out at watford after 1900, would I have to pay a peak of about £3.70 or an off peak of £1.50 on PAYG if I dont break my journey between Euston/Baker Street (if I used the met line instead) and Watford. There is a potentially several hundred pound saving possible. I fear that to take advantage of the off peak from euston, I would have to wait for the 7.04 or 7.24 trains. Its also a pain that there is no zone 3 station on the met line.
Many thanks
Nick
Hi Nick,
You are not alone. Lots of people have decided to seriously look at cutting their travel costs. I have bad news and good news for you.
Bad news first. Because of OSIs your journey is strung together so that it becomes one, starting at Vauxhall. The charge is decided by the touch in time at Vauxhall. There are two ways to get round this. First, wait 40 minutes between touch out at Euston tube and touch in at Euston NR; or touch on a bus (and then get straight off again) between the two. The bus breaks a rail journey as does exceeding the OSI allowance. Unfortunately you are right when you suggest that you’ll have to get the 1904 at the earliest to get the off-peak fare, and make sure you wait on the concourse until after 1900.
Now the good news. How does a £984 saving grab you? The default route for Watford Junction to Vauxhall is via Clapham Junction. As long as you don’t touch in/out in zone 1 you only need a Z2-9+W season. If you occasionally need to go through zone 1 then it would only cost you £2 extra from your PAYG balance for each journey.
Hope that helps.
Hi Mike, thanks for you website – its very helpful! I think i now understand that if I commute from Stockwell to Hatton Cross by tube, I cannot purchase a Zones2-5 monthly travelcard as I have to change at Green Park. Is there a more affordable option e.g. Part Payg, than to buy a Zones1-6 travelcard?
Hi Mike,
Sorry for the late response, still on my question on travelling from East Croydon station (z5) to Victoria station (z1), Paddington station (z1), South Kensington (z1) [multiple trips within z1] and back to East Croydon(z5) of up to 3 times per week
Is it wise & cost-effective to buy a PAYG and Travelcard together? Or should I just stay with a PAYG? I need to travel during the peak periods before 930am.
If I were to buy a PAYG+Travelcard, what zones should I be buying on the PAYG and what zones on the Travelcard?
If just using the PAYG, what zones should I be buying on this card?
Sorry I am abit confused.
Please advise me and thank you.
Warmest regards,
Calista
HI,
I stay in Isleworth and work in paddington. I buy a oyster travel card from zone 1-4.
For mornings I take southwest trains from isleworth station at around 6 AM get of at waterloo and then use bakerloo line from waterloo to paddington.
For evening it same journey around 6:30 PM
I have a car so the only time I use train is while travelling to office and I am actually finding the current price too expensive to pay. that too on a crowded train.
Weekend the car is useless for me.
Infact travelling by car and parking it there is almost the same as travel card charges.
Any ideas to save money. I am ready to park my car at Southall / ealing broadway and then take first great western from there.
But there is nothing that saves me a penny…
Can you help
Hi Dale,
When it comes to seasons you can buy zones 1-5 which is a bit cheaper than 1-6. If you can find any suitable buses to take out some of the zones then that can also help, eg a bus from Hatton Cross to a zone 3 station means that you’d only need a zone 1-3 travelcard as buses are free with any travelcard.
Hi Calista,
With PAYG the system caps you automatically according to the zones you use. The most you would pay on your itinerary per day is £15.80 which is the zone 1-6 anytime cap. A weekly travelcard for zone 1-5 is £49.80 which is just more than 3x the daily cap at £47.40. If you make any other journeys during the week it might then be worthwhile, or a monthly ticket might also be slightly cheaper than daily ones, particularly if you can time the month to maximise working days. I don’t think a mixture of travelcard and payg is going to help much in your situation.
Hope this helps,
Mike.
Hi Manu,
Is waiting until 7pm to come home an option? If it is, then both your journeys are at off-peak times and you could do them for £3.70 each way. This works out a little cheaper than the weekly travelcard. Alternatively you could save more by driving to Southall because FGW trains operate on the TfL rate rather than the NR+TfL combined rate. Southall to Paddington is £3.60 peak and £2.60 off-peak. The same rates would also apply on the Picadilly line from Hounslow Central or East or Osterley or Boston Manor. You can also use buses for free with any travelcard if that might potentially save petrol or parking charges.
Hope that helps.
Dear Mike, thank you for your reply
Warmest Regards,
Calista
Hi Mike
I have a zones 1-5 annual travelcard on Oyster (with Gold Card discount loaded) and occasionally travel to Elstree and Borehamwood in the evenings, usually via West Hampstead. If I time my change at West Hampstead so that I take the first Thameslink train after 7pm, is there a way that I can ensure that I am only charged the off peak (discounted) rate for the zone 6 extension (95p) as opposed to the (undiscounted) peak rate (£1.60)? As the Jubilee and Thameslink platforms are physically at different stations, will an OSI still always apply and, if so, would it be possible to break the journey by touching in and out a couple of times at one of the West Hampstead stations or by using validators?
Many thanks
Steve
PS. Just to clarify, I would be commencing my journey from London Bridge during the evening peak, but looking to make my change at West Hampstead after the evening peak.
Hi Steve,
If you touch normally it will combine the journeys and class it as peak. There are two guaranteed ways to break this, either take more than 20 minutes between touches at West Hampstead or touch on a bus and get off again. However, as West Hampstead is within your zones you could probably get away with starting a new journey at the Underground station (touch in but not out again) and then touch in at the Thameslink station. That should confuse the system enough, but I’ve not done it so I can’t be certain. Please come back and let us know if you try it. You might need to use the reader by the manual staffed gate when you touch in at the Underground or you not going through the gate might confuse other people and their cards.
Hope that helps.
Hi! I actually live in zone 2 (canada water) and work in Canary wharf.
I am tentative to buy a zone 2-3 monthly ticket as it is currently around £25 cheaper. However, how much will I be charged if during the weekends I will get out in zone 1 or pick a tube in zone 1 to come to Zone 2?
Also, is there any difference between a Zone 2 only or a Zone 2-3 as they are the same price? It seems better then to go to the 2nd option.
Many thanks!
Joao
Hi Mike, thanks for helping everyone here, seems to be a big help! I will shortly move to London to start my new job in kingston and I will most likely travel from Wimbledon via the train. I assume that the annual pass is the cheapest to travel as i will make 5 return journeys per week? If so can I get a discount with my 16-25 railcard? if so how much would it be? Thanks very much!
Hi Joao,
I’m confused. Canada Water to Canary Wharf is one stop on the Jubilee line. Single fares are £1.50 peak, £1.40 off-peak. A monthly travelcard costs £84.50, or almost 29 return journeys. Unless you work every day, or catch a bus somewhere, you should be using PAYG.
To answer your other questions, the smallest travelcard covers two adjacent zones so you would get a zone 2-3. If you travelled in to or out of zone 1 you pay for a zone 1 single which is £2.
Hope that helps.
Hi Gavin,
Season tickets are already discounted compared to return fares so there is no further discount for railcard holders. An annual season is the cheapest rate, but if you can’t afford the whole lot in one go then buy monthlies with a few days added on so they cover a whole 5 or 6 weeks starting on a Monday and ending on a Friday. Then miss that weekend and start the next ticket on the Monday. If you time it right you can get long weekends free and also annual leave. This can work out not much more than an annual without the upfront payment.
great site thanks for it. i would like your advice i need to travel from zone 2 to zone 4 and i have 2 ways one is crossing zone 1 or using overground. Overground is cheaper 968 pounds for annual, but zone 1-4 is more expensive 1672. most weekends i will go to the zone 1, would you suggest buying a 2-4 zone and using pay as you go for occasional trips to zone 1, or just not bother and go for a full zone 1-4 card ?
Hi ramzez,
If you go into zone 1 and out again every Saturday and Sunday for a year it would cost £2 x 2 x 2 x 52 = £416. This is a lot less than the difference between the tickets so I’d go for the zone 2-4 and use PAYG when going to zone 1.
Hi Mike
I have a question. I am going to be travelling from Margate to Bromley each day starting next month and planning to buy a Margate- zone 5 and 6 national rail card. On 1- 2 days some weeks I need to travel to New Cross however, and the easiest way to do this is to stay on the train past Bromley until London Bridge, then get another line down to New Cross in zone 3. How can I do this using both my travel card and Oyster card as surely once I am on the train outside of zone 5 using a z5-6 travel card this is an offence? There will be no way I can scan in my oyster card either as I will not leave the station at London Bridge, but will need to use this to get out of the station at New Cross. I am very confused about how this will work out and do not want to end up with a fine…. Thanks in advance for your help.
Hi Tiffany,
The simple answer is to forget Oyster. What you need on those days is a day travelcard for zones 1-4. These cost £7.70 off-peak and £10.60 if you need to use it before 0930. Because both your tickets are zonal there is no requirement for the train to stop at any station in or near zones 4 or 5. You can buy them from Margate, or order them online to be picked up from the ticket machine at Margate. If ordering online you enter a station within zones 1-4 in the From box (eg Lewisham) and “London Zones 1-4″ in the To box. For some wierd reason it doesn’t work if you specify a London Terminal, so don’t use London Bridge. If buying at the station and the clerk doesn’t know how to issue it, tell him to use NLC 0034 with Lewisham. You may need to show your season ticket to prove you have a valid ticket to get to the boundary between zones 4 and 5. The combination is 100% valid, however. There is no gap between zones in London and you don’t need to double up on zone 5.
Hope that helps.
Thanks Mike. Am I able to use my 18+ student oyster to purchase a cheaper zone 1-4 day travelcard??
Also, I have been on the national rail site and TFL and cannot find anywhere online that I am able to input zone 1-4 as an option and buy a travel card online. Can you please advise as to how this is possible? Everything else makes perfect sense- thanks again for the advice.
The 18+ Student Oyster card only discounts period travelcards. If you have a 16-25 Railcard you can get dicounted off-peak day travelcards, but only the zone 1-6 variety which costs £5.60. You also can’t use this before 1000 Mon-Fri.
For buying the travelcard you need to go to one of the train company websites like http://www.southeasternrailway.co.uk.
Hi I am traveling out of the country on the 23rd of April and need to make my way to London gatwick airport and I am looking for the cheapest route. I have a half price bus travel concession so I plan on trying to use this to cheapen my journey to the airport. So according to tfl I need to make my way to either London bridge station (where I can take the capital connect) or Victoria station where I can take either the gatwick express or southern line. So I plan using busses to head to either of the mentioned stations as it will turn into a days bus pass after some travels n save me on expenses, now I want to know if my oyster card would work for capital connect, southern line and gatwick express. now I know they are deffinately not within my bus concession hence it will cost me but I don’t know the prices for them and I have searched high and dry for pricing on those. Also if I am able to use my oyster-card (providing I credited my oyster with enough for the PAYG journey), how they charge to journey to gatwick airport in oyster, how much it will cost me AND if this will affect my half price bus concession especially when after it’s turned into a 50% cut of a day travel on bus using oyster card. Hope my query makes sense.
Hi Danielle,
Unfortunately you can’t use your Oyster to Gatwick Airport. I can’t check current fares easily at the moment, but you have a number of options. First off though, don’t use Gatwick Express! It’s not really that much faster and costs more. You can either get a “Not Gatwick Express” ticket from London which is valid either from Victoria or London Bridge. Or, if you can get cheaper travel with your Oyster then you could use that to East Croydon and then purchase a FCC only single to Gatwick from there. The FCC only ticket from London is more expensive than the Not Gatwick Express. I’ll add prices later if I can work it all out.
Hello, thankyou very much Mike, you been great help, really appreciate it. First time travelling via an airport other than heathrow and not easy routed too. Guess non gatwick express via Victoria or London bridge appears to be the less costly route, will see if i can get hold of how much it costs prior to my journey, fingers crossed. And please feel free to let me know of any new developments regarding my query, thankyou and have a great day
Hello,
I would like to ask you if its legal to travel from Twickenham(Z5) to Purley(Z6) with a paper travelcard Z5-6?
Thanks
Hi Paul,
It depends how you do it. If you use trains the whole way then no, it isn’t. If you use buses and trams, optionally combined with trains in zones 5 and 6 only, then yes it is. You could do train to Kingston, bus to Sutton, train to West Croydon, tram to East Croydon and train to Purley.
Hi Mike,
I am a tourist from Slovakia and I’ve found this site really helpful. I hope you can help me too with my preparations for visiting London.
I will be visiting London in March for a week (8 days to be precise), as a standard tourist. Most probably I will be living in Z3, with everyday commuting into Z1 (in peaks) and several trips outside Z3 (Windsor and Hampton Court). From what I have already read I have come up with two scenarios (both involving Travelcard Z1-3) and I would be very grateful if you helped me to decide which one – or maybe even find another one – is better for me.
Alt.1: From what I understood from TfL site, if I buy Travelcard (in my case 7-day) from Visitors online shop it would be a paper ticket. Can you confirm that? In that case I assume I would be spared of any touch in/out procedures…
How should I cope with the trip to Hampton Court in terms of most economic travel? Can I go to Waterloo, buy there a return ticket from Wimbledon (the last train stop covered by my Travelcard) to Hampton and get on the train already in Waterloo? Or, do I have to go to Wimbledon by Tube and only there buy and get on the train? The same vice versa on the return trip…
The same schema valid for Windsor trip and Paddington/ Ealing Broadway stations…
Alt.2: to buy an Oyster with PAYG and again 7-day Travelcard (as it is cheaper than PAYG with everyday return trips between Z1-3, at least one trip per day in a peak).
Do I have to touch in/out within stations covered by Travelcard?
What do I need for applying for Oyster upon arrival: any special IDs, photo,…?
How is it with the refunding of any unused PAYG credit and deposit for Oyster at the end of my stay: will I get my money in any tube station basically immediately? Can I encounter any problems when trying to refund the money (I read somewhere there might be some troubles when mixing cash with other payment types…)? To be honest, I fear of refunding the most in this alternative…
On Hampton trip (planned on Sunday) I wouldn’t buy a paper ticket (as PAYG Z3-6 is cheaper). I would get on the train in Waterloo without any questions now but can I touch in already in Waterloo (with touching out in Hampton) to calculate the fare correctly (from Z3-Z6)? Or touching in in Wimbledon is necessary?
What alternative do you see better for me? Any other advices?
Thanks a lot, Mike, and sorry for a little bit longer entry
Roman
Hi Roman,
Hopefully I can help. I’ll try and pick out the questions in the same order. To start with a travelcard from the visitor shop would be on paper and would therefore not require touching in and out, although where gates are involved you’ll need to insert the ticket to open the gate.
In terms of your trips to Hampton Court and Windsor there is actually a slightly cheaper alternative. You can buy a ticket from “Boundary zone 3″ to your destination from either London terminal and then travel on a direct train. This way you avoid double paying for zone 3. In both your cases the boundary fare is cheaper, although that isn’t always the case to any station outside the zones.
Now the oyster option. If you need to open gates you will have to touch in and out anyway. It’s probably best to do this even if the gates are locked open or there are validators because it gets you in the habit. You don’t need any ID to get a normal adult Oyster card. There are refund issues if you have used multiple payment methods to top up but if it’s a problem they can send a cheque. I’m not aware of a problem if you pay the deposit and any topups by cash. You can still pay for the travelcard by credit card. Ticket machines can dispense PAYG Oyster cards with some top-up already loaded. You can then add a travelcard as a separate transaction, using a ticket office if it makes you happier.
For Hampton Court you touch in at Waterloo and out at Hampton Court and it will only charge you for zones 4-6. Simple! For Windsor you can still get the boundary zone ticket. You’ll need to show your Oyster card or paper travelcard to get this ticket.
The only other advice I can think of right now is to check engineering work on the Sunday. If part of the journey is going to be replaced with a bus you may decide to do Hampton Court another day.
Hope that helps.
Hi Mike, thanks a lot for your explanations. You definitelly helped me a lot. One more question: do you know how much is “Boundary Zone 3″ to Hampton Court ticket compared to PAYG Z4-6 £1.80 price? ‘Cos that’s the only difference point in financial terms between my two alternatives.
Thanks, Roman
Hi Roman,
BZ3 to Hampton Court is £3.10 single, £5.40 return.
Hi Mike, so PAYG option is cheaper. Hopefully the last question: with PAYG with Travelcard on, a trip from Paddington to Windsor. Where to touch in/out (if necessary) on this route: is it possible to touch in/out at Windsor and Eton Central? Thanks, Roman
Hi Roman,
Oyster is not accepted beyond West Drayton on the line to Slough/Windsor. So on that trip I would ask for the “Boundary zone 3″ to Windsor return at Paddington. You may need to show your Oyster so the clerk can check that there is a travelcard on it. Then you can use the Oyster to open gates at Paddington and the paper ticket at the other end.
Hi Mike, if I got it correctly, inserting paper ticket somewhere at Windsor end of the journey will let the system know that I finished the journey (which started at Paddington with touching in) there? Because there is no other touching out on the way there…
Yes. Within the zones on your travelcard the Oyster system doesn’t worry about incomplete journeys. It’s best to get in the habit of always touching in and out so that it can charge you the right amount for any PAYG extension (eg Hampton Court), but if you are combining a travelcard with a paper ticket there is no need to worry about touching at the changeover.
Hi quick question.
If I buy a Zone 2-3 monthly travelcard (Ealing Common – Oval) will I be charged to leave Oval station, even though it falls into the zones I have bought? if so how much?
Ho Simon,
Quick answers: Yes and £2. You have to go through zone 1 so it’s a zone 1 single which is £2 all day.
Thanks mike! Do I also pay another £2 when I return home to Ealing Common?
Yes, it’s £2 per journey involving zone 1.
Thanks Mike… Managed to get my company to by me a yearly 1-3 pass
Hi I travel everyday (mon-fri) from east croydon to elephant and castle.
I buy a zone 2-5 travelcard and use the overground.
However about 2or 3 days a week on the return journey will have to go via london bridge because of train times.
Obvs this is out of my zones. Is it going to charge me a whole PAYG journey from elephant n castle (via london bridge) to east croydon £5.90 or will it only charge me using the tube to london bridge and the little bit of train covering zone 1 before it enters zone 2? Bearing in mind I will scan in at london bridge and out at east croydon. And a zone 1-6 travelcard is sooooo much more money. confused? :/
Hi Dean,
It will charge you £2 every time you go through zone 1. This is because you have a travelcard including zone 2 so the extra for any mixed zone 1 journey is just a TfL zone 1 fare.
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